How I started selling at Urban Outfitters | Pivoting, Persistence, Power of Networking | Perkies Founder, Rosie Mangiarotti

Rosie is the founder of Perkies, which makes innovative undergarments for women. Perkies' first product was a sticky bra with replaceable adhesives, since the adhesive wearing off or becoming dirty is the reason why most traditional sticky bras have a short usage life. Rosie also turned the head around nipple covers and created Perkies Nips, which are stick-on nipples, which have become a pop-culture favorite at Urban Outfitters along with the free-the-nip trend, as well as worn by breast cancer survivors and previvors to reclaim their femininity and confidence post-mastectomy.

Rosie shares her advice on problem-solving and mindset, including the importance of enjoying the journey -- lessons she learned the hard way losing games and not getting playing time as part of the women's lacrosse team at Brown, as well as the power of networking and not taking no for an answer.

I am in such awe of Rosie and I am so grateful we met at Brown! Her positivity, energy and radiance is contagious. Thanks again for your time, Rosie, I don't take it for granted!

Chapters
(00:00:00) Perkies Sticky Bra with Replaceable Adhesives at Brown
(00:03:49) 3 Years of Branding, Learning & Changing the Name of the Company
(00:08:38) Power of Networking and Persistence
(00:09:04) Selling with Urban Outfitters & Getting Them as a Buyer
(00:12:54) Selling on Amazon, Direct Website, Urban Outfitters
(00:17:31) Finding the Gap in Market in Diversity of Bra Colors in UK & Australia
(00:20:06) Being Accommodating to Retailers for Long-Term Strategy
(00:24:13) How Hailey Bieber's Free the Nip Look Inspired Perkies Nips
(00:26:14) Partnering with Breast Cancer Research Foundation 
(00:26:54) Empowering Women Post-Mastectomy with Non-Permanent Stick-On Perkies Nips
(00:31:05) Keeping the Mind Strong with Working Out, Sleep, Friendships & Enjoying the Rollercoaster of the Journey

Transcript

Rhaime Kim: 0:00

Rosie manda rotti is the founder of herkes, which makes innovative undergarments for women including sticky bras with replaceable adhesives along with perky nips, which is actually now available at Urban Outfitters. So Rosie, thanks so much for taking the time today.

Rosie: 0:17

Of course, thank you for inviting me on to the podcast. Monterde.

Rhaime Kim: 0:21

Could you tell us about perky like, What are y'all doing? What are you all about?

Rosie: 0:25

The initial premise behind herkes was to create a better stick on bra. And for those listening who don't know what a sticky bra is, it's a backless and strapless bra that sticks directly to a woman's breasts. And the huge problem with current sticky bras is that after you wear them a few times, they begin to lose adhesion, and they get dirty and gross. But the only real issue is with the adhesive. So perky creates sticky bras layered and replaceable adhesives. So instead of buying a whole new bra, you could just buy the replacement packs. Since working on it, we've launched Perkins pedals, which are reusable nipple covers. And then more recently, we've launched perky snips, nipple enhancers, which kind of play into the pop culture trend of freedom nip and you know, if you walk around, a lot of women are embracing the freedom uptrend. But they're also a great product for breast cancer survivors or providers who no longer have nipples post mastectomy can love how you've been able to expand your product lines, just see you change with different just discovering different people's needs. So starting with the reusable sticky bra, how did you go from having the idea until having the first reusable sticky brought in your hands? Like did you have any manufacturing connections before I wouldn't know where to begin? Yes, I didn't know either. And I give a lot of credit to brown. So I actually came up with the idea back in high school. And I mentioned it to my friend gab and she logged it on her idea list. Because I turned to her once and I was like they need to create sticky bras and replaceable adhesives. Like I think we're on vacation and my sticky Brown was totally sweating off. And fast forward five years later, I'm in Danny workspace class at Brown. And part of that class was creating a business plan off of an idea that solves a customer pain point. So with my team of five classmates, we brainstorm ideas, and I reached out to gab and I was like, I know some of those ideas on her list are mine. And she's like, the only one to remember is the sticky GRE idea. And thankfully, most of my team of classmates were women. And all the women in the group were like, that's such a no brainer. Let's do it. Yeah. So tangible, it's easy to wrap your head around. Anyway, worked on it through Danny worst case class. And that kind of gave me confidence in the idea. And then it also gave me a lot of clearly was very passionate about it. I remember after that semester, throughout the summer, people ask me how my year was. And I was just like glowing talking about this sticky bride. Yeah, the sticky roof project. And then going into senior year, that's when brown started putting a lot of money into their Nelson Center for Entrepreneurship. And Brown would tap on me to pitch it competitions and to apply to specific things, including V lab, where we met. And you know, from there, I kind of decided to take it on full time and someone spoke up brown once I think I was a senior. And he said, When you are young, this is the time to start a company. Don't wait till you have kids. Don't wait until you have a mortgage to pay off. Like do it when you're done. Because when you fail, you only fail so far, where when you do it when you're older, you're falling a lot further. Yeah, you will fail, you know, or throughout the process, you'll fail. Hopefully it's nothing crazy. But he really struck a chord with me. And then thankfully I have a great relationship with both of my parents and they had an extra bedroom in their house and I was able to move home with them right after our eight week summer accelerator program together. And I was able to build this and it was no easy feat. There are no public patent manufacturers in the US so I had to go overseas and then the complexities of creating a sticky brow with replaceable adhesives. It kind of puts me into two different products, the bra the bra pad and then the adhesives and the process of creating both of those are completely separate. So it was a matter of finding a prop had manufacturer overseas and then figuring out how to make this layered adhesive medical grade reusable that in the back had to be acrylic and pull tabs and oh my god that process. Yes that upon anyone. But it was great because during that three year product development process, I was able to build out the purpose for And in the initial name for parties which Ron Do you remember the original name

Rhaime Kim: 5:04

actually do your branding

Rosie: 5:08

there's there's there's a reason why you don't remember it was reliable raw.

Rhaime Kim: 5:12

Oh my god

Rosie: 5:13

yeah brutal name kind of connotates to like an old woman with a reliable bra where Perkins's lay more young and contemporary standing by usually named perky is was able to get the dome domain and trademark the name parky's. And really build out our branding so that when we launched, we kind of have this strong identifiable brand Foundation, which has since allowed me to expand on different products. And again, with that same brand identity, I'm a big silver linings type of girl. But I do look at those three years as essential in brand building. And not to mention, I also treated it like I was in business school. And I talked to every single person who could give me advice, whether it was on fundraising or marketing or brand building or developing a website and different marketing channels and selling in Amazon and Facebook marketing. It's I mean, everything under the sun, whether it was patent attorneys or accountants learned. And again, that's all served me very well. So once I was ready to launch, I also had that foundation of knowledge, which I'm still working on and still learning every day. But it was nice kind of launching with that

Rhaime Kim: 6:26

it took you three years. And was it challenging to get through that and push through and keep the dream alive? Like I have a lot of respect for you. This is a thread for many founders to like grind through and obviously those three years you said you were growing the branding and networking and really absorbing and learning everything that you cut. But how did you keep yourself motivated and feeling like you were making progress during that time of product development? Well,

Rosie: 6:58

I first like to preface this by saying I was very lucky to be living with my parents, like I wouldn't be able to do this if I had to pay for rent. And yes, on the side I would babysit and tutor and, you know, do those odd jobs. But I do. I am very fortunate. So I was able to you know, stay afloat by living with them. And then they live Long Island. So I was able to like maintain a social life and was with my friends every week in New York City. And that's what kept me going, my friends. They were the end users. They were the ones who have been had been so excited about this product since the day I told them in the grandmas lacrosse locker room. They were like my champions, and the ones who would constantly tell me that sticky bra stories and tell me how badly they needed this and that they won't they refuse. So buy a sticky bra until Porky's comes out. And I made a promise to myself I'm like, I don't care how freakin hard this is I am getting this product in the hands of my best friends and my supporters from day one. That definitely is what kept me going. And then also, I was able to learn a lot from my friends. And through spending time with them. I learned that nipple covers were an option and that a lot of women like nipple covers which kind of led me to launch parties pedals reusable that book covers, surrounding myself with my target demographic was motivating, but also gave me a lot of insights into what products I was creating and launching. I love that

Rhaime Kim: 8:31

because even the start of herkes and starting that idea and Danny where she is class back at Brown. That came from your friend Gab, right. I think it's so lovely that both potentially without Gab, this whole purposing be here so trans. It's also like your friend just like motivating you and I think that's so good that you have such a solid group of friends. And you've been able to like lean on that and that they've been like so outwardly supportive. Recently I saw perky snips are available on Urban Outfitters and I think that's such a dream for many people who have a retail brand of a fashion brand. How did that end up happening? And would you have any advice on finding sales channels or getting into places like urban

Rosie: 9:24

I mean, Fussel someone they live, it was like, did you get a sales? Rep. You're getting into all these big stores? And I'm like, Nope, I just Mosler. I do a lot of LinkedIn cold messaging, or like if there's one mutual connection, I'll be like, Hey, can you ever meet a lot of times? Once a day, but DM people on Instagram connecting with everyone under the sun? No is yeah, my vocabulary? I say yes to every connection, every relationship, every conversation every coffee date, because you do not know where those conversations will lead. Steve Jobs has a great quote about never being able to connect the dots looking forward but Only looking backward and looking backward. I'm like, Oh my God, if I didn't go to that coffee meetup in LA, right when I moved here, which I was debating going to because I just moved here and I had so much going on, I wouldn't have met this guy who connected me with this woman who was led to like, all these amazing things. So I think saying yes to a lot of things and putting yourself out there is my number one piece of advice as a supporter and knowing that that is part of the job. But the urban connection was through a friend of mine who again, friend network, who started a company called Road curls. Her name's Emily, Kennison, and she launched on urban last like six to 12 months ago, and she connected me with the buyer back in like the spring, and I had never heard back. And to be honest with you, I totally forgot that I remember reaching out to her, but like, I don't remember connecting me. So a few months later, I reached out as so crazy. Persistence, and perseverance is also the number two or if not, number one, like I keep tabs of what I do throughout the day, and throughout the weeks and the months. And at the end of each month, I'll review it to see who I need to follow up with and what fell through and what, whatever I need to do. And I was like, oh my god, I never heard from the urban team. Let me reach out to Emily. I don't think she made that intro yet. So I reached out to her. She's like, Oh, my God totally forgot it. Let me make that intro now. So she makes the insurance like the head guy. He had forgotten that she had reached out. He's like, I'm with the buying team. Now. I just pitched to them the idea. They're really into it, have Rosie send us samples. So it was just like a pure definition of persistence, and sometimes not taking no or no response for an answer. So anyway, he connected with the buying team, then they place the order over the summer. And then we launched two weeks ago, and we just sold out a couple days ago of the light nude lapstone. So I'm like, Yeah, scream for that happened. So anyway, hopefully we're on the way to the urban shelves.

Rhaime Kim: 11:59

Yeah, fingers crossed, because

Rosie: 12:00

you're available on our website.com. Yes, check us out.

Rhaime Kim: 12:06

I would imagine that that's so whole, like learning with? Well, first of all, with reaching back out to your friend Emily, that definitely happens where sometimes you just have to not have an ego about reaching back out or make assumptions that it's a no, because like, the worst thing that will happen is you get rejected. But why? It's better to just reach out like I actually remember I was speaking to somebody that I'll be interviewing in a few weeks. And he didn't show up to our call. And it turns out he just got the schedule wrong and as mine, but I could have not called but I called and that's like another connection that I might not have eight crazy. So I definitely love that with the work that you do. I would imagine that a big part of it is is meeting buyers and developing a network and thinking about your sales channels. What sales channels do you currently have? And what were some of the different learnings that you've had in breaking through and making progress in those different sales channels.

Rosie: 13:14

I've said the base three naturally, ecommerce so perky. Amazon, which we launched parky's pedals on Amazon, and now starting these wholesale channels, including shop urban, and then of course, like smaller boutiques, but I'm focusing more so on like the bigger scale larger orders. One thing I'm realizing is the beauty and working with a bigger retailer is they have the marketing dollars, you know, yes, they take typically like they mark up your product to two and a half times. So they're getting a cut of what you typically make if you were to sell it on your econ website. But you're also piggybacking off their marketing dollars. So a friend of mine just sent me a screenshot of the Urban Outfitters promoting perky snips to her. And I'm like, Okay, it's not my mark money. Oh, exciting. I know. I was like, seven. Yeah. And then I got targeted like an hour later. But yeah, so like, I think that's important to know. And then the brand visibility that they're giving you. I mean, yes online, and then hopefully in store in the future. But that's just like traffic, making your brand more visible and not to mention, maybe they see it and start mentioning it to a friend or they don't want to buy it right then and there. They can then go on your website later because they have your product name. It's interesting to the onboarding process with retailers. every retailer I've worked with has a different or big retailer I've worked with has a completely different onboarding process. Some of them like take these like little hidden fees. Some of them don't. Some of them are like super accommodating. Some of them make you pay for shipping. Some of them have a strict deadline. Some of them are like whenever you get it to us. So that's been interesting. And like, I think when I onboard with a new retailer, that's when my brain is at It's the highest point of learning and doing like I'm doing. I don't even know how I wrap my head around it. Some people, typically teams on board with urban has like a team of 30 people and 10 of those people are allocated to the onboarding process. But instead it's me doing it all alone. Yeah. But I'm just like, okay, so this is this is the end goal. This is what I'm here for is what what, why wake up every morning and work on per se, get into sort of urban. So it's, I think the excitement that gets me through those, that onboarding process, and like the seasons, shipping and bottle labeling and stuff. So anyway, that's my spiel on retailers, and then Amazon's great again, I've learned so much through that reviews are essential, as we all know, as Amazon consumers, how important reviews are. So it's funny to foster reviews in a legal way, because Amazon like would flag you if they found like, if I left a review on perky and then Excel, my name associated with it, they could like shut down my whole account. So that's pretty interesting. But yeah, Amazon is great. And apparently, there's a stat like 70% of online shoppers look for the product on Amazon first. So being on Amazon, especially as like, unnecessary essential product, like nipple covers, has been critical. And then also, we're prime eligible. So I send all my products, I was shipping out an order this morning, I'll send like 100 units to Amazon and put the SKU labels on it, or I'll go to one place at first. And then I think from there, they like send it all around the US. And then they're all prime eligible. So as people order them, it's guaranteed two day shipping, or one day shipping through prime, which makes it more desirable as a consumer to buy it on Amazon. Yeah, and Amazon's also big on like how you do at first. So if at first you're converting pretty well, they'll organically bring your product towards the first or second page, because people are buying it and it's converting. So like, let's say people have nipple covers, and they end up buying turkeys. And Amazon sees that they're gonna make great, they make more money, we make more money. Yeah, so like, there's like, I think like a 60 day, I might totally be watching this number, a 60 day window where you really want to focus on getting your product through specific keywords so that it can organically bring you towards the front. And Danny works. He has a great quote. The presser from Brown is branding reduced his searching costs, and it's so true. And on Amazon, we have a really low total advertising cost of spend, which basically means people are like organically finding me on Amazon by searching and perky paddles, so that the proof is in the pudding. brandings everything. The name, I think is pretty good. That's been great. And then we just launched on Amazon in the UK. So this is fascinating. I wanted to launch in the UK. Obviously, the process for VAT registration is not easy. I did it and but I wanted to make sure there was a market there before I went through the process of paying money for VAT registration and monthly fees and shipping fees. And through that search, I found that I don't think there's I mean, maybe there's one or two, but there really are not many nipple cover brands selling on Amazon in the UK that sell more than the light nude shade. And we have light, medium and dark. And a lot of our orders coming from the UK are of the medium and darker shades. And yeah, and then we just launched on Australia, I have to get my account approved, something's off right now. But we'll be live on in Australia hopefully by end of day. And same thing they're like light new shades only when you type in nipple covers for amazon.au. So, you know finding a gap in the market is critical. And then also the good thing about Australia is their reverse seasons as us so when things slow down for nipple cover purchases later in the US they start heating up in Australia and then online on forbes.com. A lot of it's just like email marketing and I have I don't have a crazy budget for like I really don't. I try to be really strategic about how I invest in marketing Tik Tok shop has been pretty good. And that's been fun to kind of be on the forefront of because a lot of I think it like there's so many hoops you have to jump through to sell through Tiktok shop. And for whatever reason we were approved early on and like the day we were approved we had one woman super nice paddles and she did one minute video completely in Spanish talking about how our paddles are better than other brands. And it went viral. And I had like two days. I was in New York and my poor roommate was in LA and I was like gee me, can you please stop me, I need you to send out all these orders. But it's been really cool to be on like the forefront of this tic tock shop and the virality of it and the organic approach to marketing more so than like the paid ads, the Google Ads the this net, which like, are way too expensive, because it's so competitive, especially for the demographic that we target

Rhaime Kim: 20:22

about that gap in the market with light shades of the nipple covers being available, but not the medium dark shades. It just goes to show that diversity and business is just good business. And I think it's really cool that you're able to just see that. And for you, I think from the very beginning, in 2018, it was very obvious that you are going to offer different shades of the sticky bras. While it's crazy for me to realize that that was a case that it was so like not really available. But I love that that's something that you're able to fill in the UK and fingers crossed soon the Australia markets, you mentioned that different big retailers do business differently. And I would think that there's some learnings in negotiation that you've had, you mentioned that, with the onboarding process, people usually have a multi person team to do that work. But have you had any learnings or mistakes or things regarding negotiation, and what have been some things that you've taken away from your experience at Purkey. So far,

Rosie: 21:30

thank you for reminding me that everything can be negotiated. But I also feel like, this is what one of my investors slash advisors told me and she actually went to ground she kind of alluded to early on with a retailer be as accommodating to them as possible, because they kind of have your fate in their hands. They could at one, nevermind, we don't want to work with you. And then there goes like your biggest account you'll ever get. So I think it's kind of like a prove that you're a good seller. And then, you know, from there, negotiate. But I do think there is something to be said about being accommodating just to start, then they realize how badly they need you. And then you could start the negotiating.

Rhaime Kim: 22:13

That definitely makes sense, especially because in retail, there's just so many amazing brands, I think it definitely makes sense to be accommodating and know, like what timeline of a game you're playing are playing a long term strategy. So it definitely makes sense that especially with working with a big retailer, like urban just being associated with urban is like good enough.

Rosie: 22:37

And another note just have that no margins are critical. And I remember, probably again, it was dandy, but like margins can make or break your business. Right now, the sticky bras aren't exactly where I need them to be margin wise. So I'm kind of leaning more into the pedals in the next but better margins easier to produce easier to manufacture easier to scale. And because of those margins, I'm able to have so much wiggle room amongst retailers. And I probably shouldn't be saying this on the podcast. But it does give you that flexibility, where if you're only working within you know, a specific percentage of margin, then you don't have that flexibility where you know, you have that bigger margin, you have a little bit more flexibility in living room. Yeah.

Unknown: 23:28

And I think that sometimes you're talking about margins and the importance of margins. I think there's sometimes great ideas. And then there's also like, you have to balance that with does this make business sense? So I can definitely imagine that if you have a product suite, even if all of them are really interesting and provide great value to clients, the one with the higher, like higher margin is the one you strategically focused on because that's going to be what is the biggest thing for the amount of time you put in? The idea of the nips, I think is fantastic. And personally, you know, I don't know if I've seen anything like that before. Could you tell me about how you got the idea for nips

Rosie: 24:10

was spring of 2022. My mom and I are watching the Mad Cow. And my mom and I are like big fan girls of Haley Bieber. And then she came out in this gorgeous white silk dress and her nipples were prominently showing through her dress, and my mom and I like to each other. And my mom also is like, always thinking of like good ideas. We're always proud. We're big. We're big problem solver family, and we like looked at each other. We're like a she looks amazing. Always. And they were like, Oh my God. Like that's now look, and it is a luck. And I remember the next day I was in New York City walking around and I swear every single woman I walked by was wearing like a tank top with their nipples like permanent like prominently showing through their top. I was like, oh my god, it's a trend. So I thought I mean meanwhile Like most people who have a nipple cover company would have a heart attack when Haley Bieber is wearing her nips out, like that's totally the antithesis of what we do. But I'm like, if you can't beat them, join them. So, like the next day, I reached out to my intern from Brisby shoe on, and I was like a shoe, do you mind making a 3d rendering of a fake nipple? So I sent over the prominence and prominence and the width. And, you know, my vision for what this nipple would look like, which is basically a nipple on like a nipple cover, like, emulation of a nipple on a nipple cover. And he sent me the rendering, and I reached out to my nipple cover manufacturer like, Hey, can we open up a mold? And we I asked for, like 100 units sister? And they said yes, because I paid for the mold. And it was like a trial run. And I we did the three shades. And I started giving them to people, I started wearing them. And I was like, Oh, Baby, this is this is it? Yeah, ever since we've just been promoting them. And outside of it being a pop culture train. And in that moment, I was like, Oh, my God, this is a stone, I immediately thought of the breast cancer community since early 2022. perfuse has been a partner of the Breast Cancer Research Foundation, BCRF. And instead of writing a check, at the end of each month, I was like, there has to be a tie in like we were creating, like nipple covers that like, are on a woman's breasts, like, there has to be something we could do with the breast cancer community. And it's fine, as you know, writing a check to them. So instead of just doing that, I would reach out to survivors and providers and women who are active on tech company Instagram, and would listen to Instagram lives and would get on phone calls with these women and learn about their experiences and their needs and their wants. And through that process, I learned that a lot of women post mastectomy. And for those listening mastectomy is when a woman gets her breasts removed, it could be a double mastectomy or a single mastectomy, a there's a lot of unevenness and scarring. So that's kind of where the nipple covers can play a role because it can help smooth things. But essentially, women get their breasts removed, which is one surgery, then they get the reconstructive surgery, which is surgery. Number two, a lot of woman can't or don't opt for surgery number three, which is then the nipple reconstructive surgery. And that's again, where we come in. And it's a non permanent option, it's kind of it could be a intermediate option for the woman. Or it could just be an option for them to wear and feel that sense of having a nipple. Another option is permanent tattoos, but a lot of women don't want to get permanent tattoos. And upon launching this, we actually just launched on a company called Anna odo earlier this month, and it's a mastectomy bra company. And the feedback and thoughtful responses I've gotten for our product has been the most moving part of this entire business startup journey, what some women are saying, you know, it's fake, but it's made me feel whole again, you've renewed my sense of sexuality, you've given me back a piece of myself, you've given me my femininity back. And to give women options, you're empowering them. There's like a complete direct correlation. And when women are like stripped from their breasts and stripped from their nipples, and they are given two options, either a permanently hard nipple or no nipple. To give that third option is a really special thing to give the nips are double wrong, no pun intended for the pop culture. And people like me who want the freedom, that luck who don't have like perfectly perky nips all the time. And then for woman who had breast cancer, and it gives them that sense of self. And that sense of confidence, clearly my favorite product

Rhaime Kim: 28:51

and love that once you saw Haley Bieber, you took action the next day, and then it's grown and and you've been able to touch woman in a way that maybe you didn't expect the day that you got the idea. And I think that's such like a beautiful thing. And I love that you've been open to creating new products and evolving the business in different ways. But then once it's out in the real world, there's another whole layer of what does it mean to people and how do they use your product. So I think that's just such an incredible story. And it just ties so well back to the fact that from the very beginning, you had a partnership with the Breast Cancer Research Foundation. And so it's just this nice, really like full circle moment again, as well. Right now, what is the most important challenge or thing that you're focused on? Regarding herkes?

Rosie: 29:43

I would say growth is kind of I'm at this inflection point where I'm like, Okay, now, how do we bring to the next level? And I mean, every day it's like, keep my head above water, water, I'm treading water. But at the end of the day, I'm a one woman show and I As I grow, it's almost time like a cap sign to like, I need money right now to help me grow. And so I could bring on someone else and bring on a new hire and like really hit the ground running and grow. But I need like a few more proof points and validation points to raise that money at the valuation that I deem purpose worthy of have, hopefully, we'll get into urban source, and maybe a few of the big retailers. And I think from there, I'll be able to raise some more money, get a better idea on our marketing plans. And then, you know, ideally, bring someone on if not full time, part time and be able to divide and conquer, because it's definitely challenging. Doing it. I mean, it's crazy, right? And throwing in like, a bunch of weddings and my social life. And it's just, I mean, I also look at it, as I'm young, I'm capable, I'm healthy and aren't kids, I don't have a husband, I don't have a boyfriend. So I'm able to, like fully go all in on this. And I'm taking advantage of this like golden period of my life to give it all to porkies with the knowledge that it's not always going to be like this. You're for the ride.

Rhaime Kim: 31:05

How do you keep your mind strong? Do you focus a lot on working out making sure you have certain working hours like what are certain habits or things that you do to like, keep that like mentality there and mindset strong?

Rosie: 31:20

Yes, I am. A big, I am in a complete. So I do try to work out every day. Sometimes it's 30 minute yoga. peloton, sometimes it's just a walk on the beach, like a 10 minute walk to the beach, which is amazing. But I think it's super important to like, take care of your physical health. And then I always say like, as a one woman show or as a founder, like the company lives and dies by me. And if I'm not taking care of myself, the company is not being taken care of. So I've begun working out I'm big on eating healthy, and I'm big on sleep. I think getting my nine hours a night is critical. And then also like having a life outside of purpose. And that's what keeps me sharp. Also, I am constantly learning through my social life and through dinners of girlfriends and through beach walks with my sister, I'm learning what their needs are, and being able to incorporate that into the business. So like, as much as that's like a non business part totally ties back into the business. And since moving out to LA, there are a ton of networking opportunities. So I find myself out and about way more often than just like sitting on my computer inside. And I think balance is important as an entrepreneur. Yes, there are the days where you just need to like sit on your computer sitting at work. But then it's the magic happens off your computer, and meeting people and meeting business owners and people who have those connections to the Urban's of the world I recently read. So it's probably a meme. But it was about like, Get off your computer, the magic happens outside. And it's so true. So saying yes to like work dinners and events. And yeah, the west side of LA is definitely big on events, I could probably go to five a week if I chose to. And then also, just not, not letting that lowest of lows get you down and not letting the highs of high is too high. Just knowing that it's a roller coaster and bad days are followed by great days. And the best days can be followed by not so great days. And just knowing that, you know, it's a journey. And it's about the journey. It's not about the destination. I know it's cliche, but it's true cliche, those

Rhaime Kim: 33:23

things. They're cliche because they're real, but you don't understand that they're real until you live through them. You talked about don't get too down and by the low lows don't also don't get too high when things are going really great. I feel like people have said that but I working on this podcast. Like when you're working on your own thing. You just get really riled up and sometimes you're in bed you're like, oh my god, I'm excited about this. Like, I want to do it now and then afterwards, you feel so tired. If you go on that high of being celebratory and super excited about something. Do you think you've just gotten used to some of the highs and the lows and it's like part of your process or totally? Yeah,

Rosie: 34:06

I honestly think I'm like numb to it. Like okay, knowledge is power and like by living it for five years now. It's just like, Okay, this is normal here like

Rhaime Kim: 34:13

always you're learning or meeting new people like making those connections. It's really cool and like growing but I guess still try to be a little bit unattached to like the outcome and keep on going keep on growing and changing a lot. pride

Rosie: 34:26

aside, ego aside. Yeah. And again, yeah, comes from doing it for so many years and like not caring what other people think about you.

Rhaime Kim: 34:34

What advice would you have given yourself when you were getting started back in 2018. Looking back now,

Rosie: 34:40

I would say embracing the pivots and embracing the change and like knowing that idea number one might not be the end all be honest. There's better things in the pipeline. You know, being open to change, but also highlighting what I just talked about is pride aside, like yourself Al said being authentic to the brand and not caring what other people think is essential as an entrepreneur you can't go into with ego, you'll be let down too early on, and understanding that failures. Part of the process. I played lacrosse at Brown. And I correlate a ton of what I've learned from division one sports to being an entrepreneur. And I set out four full years of varsity lacrosse without quitting and without, I mean, it's like, with a good head on my shoulders, just by not winning that many games not getting playing time. And understanding that like getting wins and getting playing time isn't what it's about. It's about the people you meet along the way. And the journey. And that's like completely correlated to my experience with parky's

Rhaime Kim: 35:49

just going with the grind and grinding and not being so fixated on those things that are like big on ego, you've always like had just kind of like a radiant vibe and you have a lot of energy. So I think maybe having that mentality has helped you kind of get over it and just enjoy.

Rosie: 36:08

Like, yeah, I don't know if that's genes or nature or nurture, or my parents. I don't know why I'm like reading rose colored glasses. Like it's really helpful.

Rhaime Kim: 36:20

Yeah, definitely. Otherwise you're just, it's just dark. You know, Rosie, where can we find you? Where can the audience find Perkins products and how can we help you?

Rosie: 36:29

Yes. Well, as you know, we're all in southern urban parties.com is our website. My perk ease is our Instagram and Perkins is spelled PRK i e s ways in which listeners can help me are getting me introduced to buyers of stores like urban and just spreading the word about turkeys.

Rhaime Kim: 36:49

Cool. Rosie, thank you so much. I really appreciate your time.

Rosie: 36:52

Thank you so much for having me.